if you talk to a die hard pelleted feeder they will give you many reasons why pellets are the best-and same goes for a die hard ground feed guy-so what do you guys and gals think-thanks 4 any input

There was a post a couple of weeks ago that asked this same question. If the steam chamber reaches the correct temperature there can be some enhancement of digestibility and therefore offering more nutrition to the pig....can be.

But in reality, that temperature and duration of mash in the steam chamber is seldom reached.

So, the only real difference between a meal and a pellet given it's exactly the same formula, is feed efficiency. There is an improvement in feed efficiency for pelleted feed, due strictly to less feed wastage.

In short, pigs waste less feed when it's pelleted. There is no advantage in digestibility or in making middles bigger etc.... They just waste less feed when it's pelleted.

KGB- how about cost approach. Is the pellet going to cost more?

Yes, but usually the cost of pelleted more than offsets the cost in feed wastage.

I would add that there tends to be a higher incidence of ulcers in pelleted feeds, at least compared to properly ground feeds. It seems as though a lot of pelleted feed is ground finer prior to pelleting and finer-ground feed contributes to ulcer problems. Of course if your ground feed is too fine you will have the same problem.

I don't want to come across argumentative but from a price comparison standpoint you would have to waste a lot of feed and give up a lot of efficiency here in our area.

Pelleted 409's are costing us $24 a bag or $48/cwt.

The first grind and mix ration (from kgb a.k.a. Dr. Burgoon) from a local elevator using corn, meal, oats, show pig base, and sow premix will cost us $14 per 50lbs or $28/cwt. While I understand the 409 has wormer and medication and the ground feed does not it is still a considerable difference.

That is a huge determining factor for us! LOLNot to mention I am one of those old die-hard ground feed guys!!!

Best of Luck

OOPS!!! Reread kgbs post and I misunderstood his point. The additional cost of pelleting will offset the feed loss of ground feed not the other way like I thought at first.

Sorry kgb!!!!

I also said, IF the formulas were exactly the same. PRELUDE 409 and the first grind and mix and not remotely the same.

I have been told that they have to put clay in the mix for a pellet to hold together is that true or is it fiction?

Sometimes not always it depends upon the formula. It's not always clay. Binders are very useful. Some in helping to bind mycotoxins like vomitoxin.

kgb wrote:I also said, IF the formulas were exactly the same. PRELUDE 409 and the first grind and mix and not remotely the same.

If they are not even remotely the same What are the differences?

Are we losing something going to the grind and mix and should we be staying on the 409?

Thought better of the word remotely after I clicked submit. However, they are not the same. The new PRELUDE feeds (209 and 409) are different in the way they are formulated with ingredients and nutrient levels, particularly energy.

The Showpig Base makes great nursery feeds, but older/heavier showpigs do not need some of the features of the PRELUDE feeds that are specifically designed for young nursery pigs.

I had been told that there is a realitively high percentage of clay, or other "binding agents" in pellet feed that have no feed value. I would like to know if anyone knows where I can do some research on this subject. Thanks

It sounds like you don't believe what I said. In HONOR Show Chow feeds, specific types of clays are sometimes used for two reasons:
1) pelleting aid in some formulas not all
2) binding agent for mycotoxins

We do not use clay in our feeds that have no feed value. When a clay is used to one or both of the above, it has feed value.

By the way, the inclusions are usually very small (1 to 4 lbs per ton).

KGB,

Thanks for that clarification. It really shows why I am not a feed specialist. I had no idea that clay had feed value. I guess it makes sense that it could have mineral value if nothing else.

Thanks again not for only this subject but for all of subjects that you help people out with.

2 Rivers