paylean poison?

Non-Sequitor · Post by **Non-Sequitor** » Fri Aug 03, 2007 4:15 pm

Rod,

You want answers here you go. Then you need to answer my questions.

Buy my barrow, you know where it came from and who raised it enjoy with confidence, I'll be over for ribs.

Phil Seng because of his public position can not and should not say the Asians are being protectionist publicly.

I do not work for Elanco.

Yes, I believe our FDA is superior to the equivelent in China and Taiwan.

Paylean as I stated ealier has been approvd by the FDA, clenbuterol has not. I could expand on the reasons, but why bother.

I do not know any teenagers mixing feed with elevated levels of paylean. If I did I would address the situation.

I do not wish to forgo the Taiwanese market.

Show me the numbers of dead pigs at the shows, I don't see them. Oh, by the way, show me the records of the numbers shown and the death loss from 1975-1995.

Compete without chemistry, that is just asinine. Breeders have become very good at producing genetic lines that have the potential for the body type you describe. Shall we not have protien contents, mineral inclusion rates, antibiotics or vaccines?

A lot of fear mongoring by people with "high profile" positions is not productive. Why don't you defend your position that the product is being missused or that it is harmful? I want to see facts not anecdotes. Why do you instead try to intimidate those who disagree with you by marching out your ratings and position?
Why not let your argument stand on it's own merit?

DerekMyers · Post by **DerekMyers** » Fri Aug 03, 2007 8:01 pm

I don't want to sound like a "proud american" or overly proud I should say. But I think our food safety is the best in the world, in fact I think at times we over test products taking forever to get new products to market and making them more expensive due to testing costs. I proudly eat and buy american food from american farmers. If you have RFD-TV watch the 30 min show at a Cargill beef processing facility. You couldn't produce safer meat.

The only pigs I have heard of dying are stress POSITIVE pigs that get overstressed and that has been very rare and those pigs don't really fit into our food chain anyway I would think. The show pigs we raise now are much more in line with animals that productive and functional.

You will always have animals and people dying in small numbers, heart attacks, strokes and other unseen birth defects can jump on us at anytime.

Also anytime there is competition you will always have a cheater or two, but that doesn't affect the industry..its very very minor.

Overall I think pig producers of all sizes are being more and more environmentally sound and futuristic thinking. Also alot of it is public perception...the old phrase "perception is reality" is very true here. We need a positive ad campaign showing family farmers raising happy and healthy pigs with the whole family working on the farm getting their hands dirty. Again the pork industry could due well to follow the beef industry in this regard.

Derek

rod · Post by **rod** » Fri Aug 03, 2007 9:50 pm

no,what we need is a healthy dose of truth about your industry. illegal alien employing, gestation crating, subtherapeutic antibiotic dosing, performance enhancing drug using industry producing "the other white venison".I've seen the breeding stock show, you can't tell me that the boars and gilts in the top half of these classes got that way because of husbandry and genetics. the true breeders I grew up knowing and admiring wouldn't want to be part of this. just wait, it may take some time, but the old adage will hold true........in agriculture, the only safe drug is a new drug. in the meantime a lot of it is getting sold so that a few insignificant players in a meaningless corner of a major industry can get ribbons and sell a few feeder pigs while damaging trade and possibly human health. thanks for the emails from you who feel the same. rod@wlpo.net good luck

Darin · Post by **Darin** » Fri Aug 03, 2007 11:42 pm

Never heard of you. Guess I can't blame you for trying to make a name for yourself by making mountains out of molehills. Good luck with that. I won't be listening. I'd rather tune in to Trent Loos..........

Run along now.

okie · Post by **okie** » Sat Aug 04, 2007 12:11 am

Sounds like you should come get your hands dirty and then do your talk show. You cant believe things unless you experience them first hand. In every thing you do, people will lie, cheat, and steal to win. (showpigs included) Most people on this board don't even have employees, much less illegal immigrant employees. There are more illegal immigrants working as telemarketers. And, Believe it or not, there are still honest hard working people in this world. If you want to criticize someone for using illegal meds, go talk to some of the pro athletes or bodybuilders. There are still good,honest, hard working people in those groups aswell! (they are the ones who use the Clenbuterol) Maybe this post will make sense to some of you, others it may not. This whole thing aggravates me. Sounds like a city boy doing an ag talkshow who supports PETA. You need to find a new job. I

ASU_Swine · Post by **ASU_Swine** » Sat Aug 04, 2007 12:18 am

I'll second that motion.....

RingMaster · Post by **RingMaster** » Sat Aug 04, 2007 12:22 am

"illegal alien employing, gestation crating, subtherapeutic antibiotic dosing, performance enhancing drug using"

Illegal aliens are mostly employed at the meat packers that purchase these animals from us, don't pick that bone here.

Bringing up the issue of gestation crates tells me that you are most likely a member/supporter of PETA

Paylean is not a drug. There is no withdraw period so it cannot be labeled as a drug. It is a beta agonist that promotes increased muscle growth and decreased fat accumulation.

I've noticed a lot of your arguments are solely emotional and because of this you have no case.

Hog_Whisperer · Post by **Hog_Whisperer** » Sat Aug 04, 2007 2:40 pm

typical drive by media. put an emotional twist on the subject and you really don't need facts.

Please go do some real research (they still teach future media people to do that don't they?), get your facts straight and then come back and present your case complete with links to where you found your facts. Until then you are guilty of what most media outlets are guilty of, Fear mongering.

Please save your quick witted retort for another group of people that don't actually think for themselves.

RingMaster · Post by **RingMaster** » Sat Aug 04, 2007 3:47 pm

I bet Rod could get a job at CBS pretty easy, they don't seem to care if you have facts or not, let alone the right ones

HarnDog · Post by **HarnDog** » Sat Aug 04, 2007 9:15 pm

With the new style of pigs we have and the breeding that has been put in place to produce this style, Paylean will become a thing of the past in showpigs.

There are a ton of studies on Google for paylean. Even some that show use in human's with no adverse effects. The studies done by many different scientist way more educated than most of us on this board show that it is safe.

The pigs dying at shows is due to stress gene it has very little to do with paylean.

The statement you made about you seeing the top end of breeding shows and insinuating that they have been given performance enhancers (paylean) and that it could not be done by genetics is absolute POPPYCOCK!!!!!
Think about that? Come on. I am 5'10" tall and at about 250lbs I have about 10% body fat. ( I am not that size now but a few years ago that was the case lol) I have never taken a steroid in my life. It's genetics and hard work and good dieting!!!!

Could it be these breeders and our feed company's have figured out that a pig can be enhanced through diet and exercise the same as a human can? Are you saying in the 70's you had the same complete rations with advanced proteins and fat's? You don't think the human race (even us blue collar farmers) couldn't figure out that slop and corn chops are not a good source of feed?

Don't come into the bees nest waiving this crap and expect us to accept it. Get some facts and come back. Better yet get a kid a show project and come back in here and we will accept you with guiding hands.

Don't try and spoil one of the greatest tools this nation still has in raising successful hard working adults. With comments and stories you have read in a foreign magazine.

As for those that have been guilty of overusing this product most of their pigs could not make it to market anyhow. Paylean breaks them down. The muscle grows but the joints get dry due to the added moisture needed in the muscle for it to grow/pop. Used right and this does not happen. As stated above 18 grams was the legal amount it has been dropped to 9 grams and it is approved by the FDA enough said.

Have a great day.

DerekMyers · Post by **DerekMyers** » Sun Aug 05, 2007 4:25 am

Very well said Hog Whisperer-alot of times in this country its sad but true you gather around a target group of people who are afraid of fire and then start yelling fire and pointing fingers and they won't bother to look at facts. Its just about yelling loud to people who want to hear what you are saying to be true.

For me this is how I make my living, I have no employees and treat my pigs better than most people treat their dogs, if I don't care for them they don't take care of me and my family by producing.

Harndog-also well said. I would hope to death that anyone could understand improvement through superior genetics and nutrition and exercise. If anyone is so dumb to think otherwise they shouldn't be allowed to speak. For crying out loud we have the technology to clone animals and manipulate and isolate genetic markers!!. Don't you think we could improve the feed and exercise a little too?? You bet. We've proven over the past 8-10 years that we can make hogs look just about anyway we want. And with the money involved in this industry at the top end, how long do you think it will be until we have people exercising pigs on treadmills, exercising them in shallow training pools or pulling weighted sleds. Its limited only by imagination. All of those things have been in the horse industry for years now. People worry about Paylean being used to the label??? Thats nuts.........go buy Organic pork then. There has been alot of testing showing the ingredient in Ralgro cattle implants (ralgro is not a drug...works like paylean) works well on pigs. So do steriod based cattle implants, and steroids period. But those are illegal in swine although steroid implants are a long standing product in beef production.

If you wanted to see some monster pigs a few years back, you should have seem some pigs that were put out by 4H 'ers who had parents in race horse industry.......those medicine cabinets are loaded. A bottle of winstrol will do amazing things to a pig if you exercise it!!! But again illegal and we no longer are using those type of pigs to breed to or as our champions. In fact I think harndog has a point, with the way pigs need to look now and if you really just feed at the 9gr level I think paylean may be on the way out except for a few certain barrows. I know for a fact I personally am seeing it used alot less in higher end breeding stock.........now I know plenty of top boars and gilts are still fed paylean but its alot less prominant than even last year.

Derek

rod · Post by **rod** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 5:44 am

I feel like I've just looked into the window of the crackhouse of American Agriculture. When ractopamine is taken off the market, I'll be looking for you.

Hog_Whisperer · Post by **Hog_Whisperer** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 8:13 am

LOL @ that statement.

Funny, we feel like we've been exposed to the crackhouse of the media group. So it looks like were in the same boat.

I guess you just wanted to stick to quick witted retort and not show your research. You must of skipped the day they taught you to do research eh?

I feel sorry for your listening audience. I really do.

Non-Sequitor · Post by **Non-Sequitor** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 8:20 am

Just a little background info on Rod's radio employer since 1998.

According to the Spring 2007 Arbitron Ratings. Rod broadcasts on the 5th overall rated radio staion in the market his station serves. The station operates a news talk format and is rated third in that category in that market. The station has a rating of 5.0, well below the leader in that market with a rating of 8.8 and the leading news talk format rating of 7.2.

The number of adults age 12 and over for his market number 131,700.

I must say it sounds like Darin hit the nail on the head when he said "Never heard of you. Guess I can't blame you for trying to make a name for yourself by making mountains out of molehills." Thanks for the peek inside a small time radio hosts mind.

It is also interesting that he will not answer a direct question. It must be much simpler to simply pontificate and spout platitudes.

rod · Post by **rod** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 8:33 am

look at 6-10 am. it's when i'm on the air. you're wrong again. but making for some fun talk on "Farmradio" thanks trent. still rustling?

paylean poison?

ad campaign?

good luck

rod?

ahem